PSF
The Lounge => General => Topic started by: DEEcat98 on 2023-02-06 13:29:30
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People (both online and the real world) should know about the fact that it is never too late for anyone at any age to change as they should be forgiven and earn another chance after they apologized, and that giving anyone consequence, criticizing, and calling out to them is known to be illegally cruel, mean, and disrespectful.
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Good words in practice and to strive for. But you are only halfway correct.
But here is where is falls apart.
...and that giving anyone consequence, criticizing, and calling out to them is known to be illegally cruel, mean, and disrespectful.
This is simply false. People deserve consequences for poor decisions and bad actions. Otherwise they would A)never learn, or B) continue their bad behavior. None of these actions you mentioned would be illegal. Everyone's actions have consequences whether good or bad.
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Good words in practice and to strive for. But you are only halfway correct.
But here is where is falls apart.
...and that giving anyone consequence, criticizing, and calling out to them is known to be illegally cruel, mean, and disrespectful.
This is simply false. People deserve consequences for poor decisions and bad actions. Otherwise they would A)never learn, or B) continue their bad behavior. None of these actions you mentioned would be illegal. Everyone's actions have consequences whether good or bad.
What he said.
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However, there are time when people don’t get forgiven for there actions as some would consider the action unforgivable.
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So what exactly is the purpose of this post? I am not asking to be rude, but legitimately curious.
What you're saying isn't even accurate because all actions have consequences and people who do wrong need to be called out. You could play mind games and say there is no wrong or right, but that is besides the point here I think.
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I believe in second chances, maybe third chances depending on what they did... but that doesn't mean they shouldn't be scolded and face consequences.
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Find myself thinking a lot about this after the Justin Roiland debacle (https://psfforum.com/index.php?topic=443.msg604742#msg604742)... sure, you go to journo classes to learn the five W's-and-H and how to write a decent coherent article; you go to art school to learn how to compose an appealing layout for a comic page and construct a credible-looking figure, fine. I get it.
But how about teaching students how to handle their success properly when they get there? It seems like a growing number of creative minds don't get that, and a lot of content creators are seeing their careers implode because they either get caught at sexual misconduct, say things deemed racist or homophobic, or go on mad power trips, abusing underlings and ignoring the top brass' orders, creating hostile work environments. Of course, they have to be let go and replaced--but invariably, the quality goes down, the new showrunner gets blamed for everything that went wrong, and the studio boss who fired the rank offender is seen as the foolish, greedy king who killed the fabled golden goose and then gathered all his vassals together and handed each one small cup of worthless guts.
Some folks I've talked to really think this business is easy--that you can walk into a newsroom with your [bleep] in one fist and your batch degree rolled up in the other, and the doors will swing right open for you. Trust me, it's not. There's egos--both your own and others'--that get in the way. There's a game that needs to be played, and played well, if you want to make it. I had enough trouble keeping things together at a rinky-dink college paper (https://welcometolemora.webs.com/25redyellowandblue.htm). If I were to ever make it in the animation industry, I would live in constant fear of losing everything I'd built because of I unthinkingly ordered a white actress in the v.o. booth to "try to sound black", or looked approvingly at a woman's breasts and then found out later she's only 15, or just took to social media to espouse a controversial opinion not shared by my coworkers or superiors. C:-) :'(
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So what exactly is the purpose of this post? I am not asking to be rude, but legitimately curious.
What you're saying isn't even accurate because all actions have consequences and people who do wrong need to be called out. You could play mind games and say there is no wrong or right, but that is besides the point here I think.
Well if that’s the case, then that is disrespectful and cruel of them. It’s basically abusing someone and as well as being a tattletale on the person.
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So what exactly is the purpose of this post? I am not asking to be rude, but legitimately curious.
What you're saying isn't even accurate because all actions have consequences and people who do wrong need to be called out. You could play mind games and say there is no wrong or right, but that is besides the point here I think.
Well if that’s the case, then that is disrespectful and cruel of them. It’s basically abusing someone and as well as being a tattletale on the person.
No, no. It's not disrespectful. People need to be told they are wrong when they are wrong.
What you are arguing is no one to call out what is wrong. If someone murders someone, do we not call that out as wrong? Should the murderer not face consequences for their actions?
Should the world not call out on Putin for his actions? Should the world not have taken action against Hitler and the Nazis in WWII? There is a major flaw in what you are saying here, DEECat.
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It’s because everyone should deserve forgiveness after they apologized.
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(https://i.imgur.com/ZFuFM2V.png)
That isn't abusive, hun.
If a criminal simply says they are sorry for stealing or stabbing someone, should they not be taken to jail by the police?
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It’s because everyone should deserve forgiveness after they apologized.
People can be forgiven, but they still have to face the consequences for their actions.
There are some people and actions that will never be forgiven. Hitler is a key example for his killing of millions and the Holocaust. Stalin for his killing of millions of people. Mao Zedong for killing some 40 million people... etc, etc.
On a smaller scale, can you forgive a person who takes a child's innocence away from them multiple times? They get jailed, then released, and do the actions again? That is pretty hard to forgive and its appalling.
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But what if someone were to easily forgive a person for doing something atrocious to another?
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But what if someone were to easily forgive a person for doing something atrocious to another?
Doesn't matter. They can make their own choice for that. But the law will determine what happens.... the consequence for their actions.
Good luck finding the family or a murder or rape victim forgiving the criminal though.
Even Biblically we are told to call people out for their wrong actions. Matthew 18. It essentially says, "tell him his fault." The passage ends by saying that, for those who are unaffected by God’s grace and forgiveness, those people will not be forgiven either. God is not calling us to forgive someone over and over when it is clear that their hearts are unaffected by our forgiveness. We are told to rebuke him. Then, if he repents, forgive them.
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DEE. Forgiveness has to be earned. You can't just do something atrocious, say you are sorry, and all your past sins and crimes disappear. Not everyone follows these made up childhood viewpoints your are proclaiming. People who do wrong certainly need to be pointed out.
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Pointing out which is calling them out is illegally disrespectful and cruel.
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Pointing out which is calling them out is illegally disrespectful and cruel.
No it isn't. You might want to look into the definitions of words you are using, Dee. :)
You are ignoring all the examples on the previous page.
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Pointing out which is calling them out is illegally disrespectful and cruel.
No it isn't. You might want to look into the definitions of words you are using, Dee. :)
You are ignoring all the examples on the previous page.
I’m trying to state that people should know that they are being mean and disrespectful when criticizing others.
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Honestly, if you weren't gonna accept anybody's response, you were better off not posting at all.
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You can criticize someone politely. Sadly, it's a skill many haven't seemed to develop.
Punishment can be instructive, but it must fit the crime. Sadly, again, a skill many haven't developed.
I was told by my former employer that I was insincere because my "remorse stemmed from getting caught, not from being sorry about what I had done". Well... yeah. I wasn't actually sorry, so my apology rang hollow. When you're simply making a perfunctory effort to just make it all go away, only saying what you think they want to hear, people can tell.
That said, again, the punishment must be appropriate and the seriousness of the crime duly imparted. Gassing and incinerating ten million Jews and undesirables is a far cry from telling a mildly offensive joke at the company office party. Both do hurt someone, but we must take scope and intent into consideration. An unthinking oversight on my part that could open up the company I work for to a lawsuit is bad, and by all means it should be addressed, but I should not be treated like I came into the office one afternoon, dropped my britches, and gleefully defecated onto the boss' desk. And, yet another sad fact of life, "While I recognize your distress over my behavior and actions, and I do feel sick about it, believe me, I didn't do anything to feel sorry for", while a perfectly straightforward response, isn't what a boss wants to hear. They want your scalp.
And this is why I don't want to work for anyone. I simply can't take the abuse.
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I’m trying to state that people should know that they are being mean and disrespectful when criticizing others.
DEE. Listen to me here. Criticizing isn't wrong if you don't have a valid reason to do it. I think you've accepted consequences now, so lets move on to criticizing.
Would you say it is fair to criticize and punish a criminal for their actions, when the criminal doesn't apologize or accept what they did is wrong?